[man] That’s LBJ. We’ll go check out
a couple jails all around here
I lived here for 13 months.
[Peter] How was it?
The worst 13 months of my entire life
and we have a guard behind us.
-Put the camera down?
No, you’re good. I think he’ll pass us.
-He’s probably taking inmates in.
-[woman] They’re looking.
Are they looking?
So Maricopa County for years,
was in the news
and known as being one of
the worst jail systems in the country
because Sheriff Joe was very strict.
Pink underwear, horrible food
that looks like alien vomit, right?
I can’t even put it into words
how bad this stuff was.
People would sign their plea agreements
to get to prison as fast as possible
and the reason they did it that way
because they don’t want you sitting
in here taking up, you know, dollars
for months on end,
they just want you to go to prison.
-This is interesting.
Okay, so we’re gonna get into
your story a little bit today,
but tomorrow morning very early,
we’re going to another prison.
Picking up a prisoner
that’s been in 12 years?
Yeah, 12 years.
Okay, so we’re gonna get his
first moments of freedom?
But you’ve been in for seven years?
Yep. I did seven years.
-And you were a corrections officer?
-Yes.
And you fell in love inside a prison?
-We did not fall in love inside a prison.
-[laughter]
We met in there and then we met at church
after I was released and we’ve been
together pretty much ever since
Almost 10 years we’ve been together,
-But you were eyeing each other in prison?
-No, we did not like each other.
He really didn’t like me.
Yeah, she flipped my cell, as we call it.
It’s essentially when…
“House search.”
She searched my house
and she tore it apart, my cell,
and I was upset and we never got along.
-A misunderstanding.
-Yeah.
So for those like me
or many in the audience,
they don’t understand this world.
I’ve never been on the inside.
Walk us through the basics
of what’s going on here
So this is a county jail.
There is a big difference
between jail and prison.
Jail is generally much worse.
When you first get arrested for a charge,
you will see a judge within 24 hours.
The judge will decide
whether to release you then and there.
If you’re not released you will be
brought here to a jail just like this.
People are stressed because they don’t
know how much time they’re gonna get.
So you’re sitting there just waiting
to see the judge and then when you see him
he says hey come back in two months
and you do that five or six times
and eventually you’ll get sentenced
or sign a plea agreement.
There’s a lot more fights
in jail than prison.
When I was in jail
I probably got in 10 fights,
in prison I probably got in one or two.
-Why is that?
Because prison’s more relaxed
just waiting to do their time and go home.
In jail nobody knows
what’s gonna happen.
They don’t know if they’re gonna get
10 years or 20 years.
They’re coming in off the streets a lot
of these guys are under the influence.
They’re going through
withdrawals a lot of the times.
It’s just a very stressful environment.
On top of that there’s no yard,
you’re inside 24 hours a day.
So there’s no yard, they have big pods
but they can’t go outside,
can’t get sunlight on their skin.
I did 13 months in this
building right here
and when I got to prison
I looked like a ghost.
My skin was so pale
’cause I hadn’t seen the sun.
You only see the sun when
you go to court, that’s it. [chuckles]
-So Michael, obviously say
what you want to say,
but what did you go in for?
Can you share that?
Yeah, I went to prison for armed robbery
We were committing home invasions
on drug dealers
at a pretty pretty young age.
-We were 16, 17.
-On drug dealers?
Yeah, we would find out
whoever the local drug dealer was
and we would kidnap them
and take all their drugs.
-Are you serious?
-Yeah, believe it or not,
I know it sounds crazy
but it’s really common here in Phoenix.
-It seems highly risky.
-Yeah, it is, it’s not very smart.
My best friend got shot in the stomach
when we were on one of our last jobs
before we both went to prison.
So what was driving you, the money?
No, I know it’s gonna sound crazy,
but I think something’s
a little bit off with like my… brain
I’m like addicted to adrenaline
and when I do something I go 100%.
So no matter what I do I always go all in
and I become obsessive.
You know the money
was a driving factor as well
but it was the strategy of trying to
figure out how we were gonna do it.
I don’t know to be honest.
I was using drugs at the time
and making bad decisions
and it was just like
this recipe for disaster to be honest.
Did you grew up in a bad neighborhood?
No, I grew up in a good home
with good parents who loved me.
They didn’t use drugs.
They drank a little bit
but just like normal, beer and, you know?
-So nice neighborhood?
-Nice neighborhood.
I’d say upper-middle class,
my mom had horses.
We had money,
we had a good home.
I just I wanted to fit in,
that was a big part of it.
As a kid I always tried to fit in,
I guess be the cool kid and that always
got me in trouble from a young age
and eventually led me to prison.
One of the worst parts about County Jail
is the Humane Society is right next door
and the dogs that do not get adopted
by the Humane Society that get euthanized,
they cremate their bodies,
and they do it once a week,
and you can see the smoke
start rising from the stacks
and the smell comes into the jail
and you smell the smell
of like thousands of dead dogs.
It’s a horrible smell.
It’s like one of the worst smells.
I still every now and then can remember it
even though I haven’t been here
in 15 years.
-So this is just a massive jail facility?
-Yeah, there’s six jails.
-All right next to each other?
They’re all in this general vicinity.
That’s all jail up in front of us.
Last time we came here there
was three dudes sitting there
that had just been released.
[Peter] Gotta keep the camera down,
all these cops.
Like what is that?
Okay, see “Release, pickup”?
-You might want to get that sign.
-Oh, yeah.
Okay release pickup,
so they just let them out?
Yeah, there’s also a self-surrender.
So if you have a warrant
you can surrender right here.
-Okay.
This guy sitting here
may have just gotten released
’cause that’s generally where they sit.
-So if they don’t have someone
picking them up as in family or friends,
they just release there
and then then what do they do?
They’ll just give you your property
and they’ll kick you out.
-So then you just walk out of here?
-You walk right out, yeah.
Now that’s for jail.
For prison they’ll take you to
the Greyhound station and say good luck.
-Really?
-Yeah.
-Just give you a ticket?
-They don’t even give you a ticket.
They’ll give you your gate fee, $250.
They’ll get more if they saved up money.
County is like a feeling of doom.
County is so much worse than prison.
-Okay, so I thought you’d go to prison,
that’s where the gangs form.
The Whites stay with the Whites,
Blacks with the Blacks,
Mexicans with Mexicans.
Isn’t that where
that all happens, the segregation?
Then there’s that,
as you see in the movie,
the yard fights
and all of those sorts of things?
Isn’t that prison? Isn’t that the real
watch your back in the bathroom stuff?
Yes and no.
Prison sets the rules
for even the guys in County
and when you get to county jail
the people who have been to prison,
they’re gonna enforce
the rules that are in prison
but prison itself offers
a lot more things to do.
In prison you can work out,
go outside, get a job.
-You can get a job?
What do you mean?
Oh, you can rake rocks
for 10 cents an hour.
You can work in the kitchen
for 30 cents an hour.
What are some good jobs, baby?
-You can be a porter, a barber.
-Yep.
You can clean the bathrooms,
you can work for the CO3s,
maintenance, fix the fences,
painting, construction.
There’s a lot of jobs in prison
as a matter of fact.
-So what do you do with your money?
Commissary, honey buns, ramen noodles.
-Who has that?
You can buy it from the commissary.
-Okay, so they have
like the company store?
Yeah, Keefe.
Keefe is the big commissary provider
out here in Arizona.
Tastes better than the chow hall food.
So that’s the trade-off.
[Peter] Okay, so the guy
we’re picking up tomorrow morning,
do you know how he’s gonna feel
’cause you went through it?
You went through something similar, right?
Yeah, he’s very anxious.
He’s been calling every day for the
last few days and emailing us every day.
He’s very nervous. He’s probably
a little bit more nervous than I am.
So we’re gonna
take that into consideration.
-What’s he nervous about?
-Just getting released, it’s easy…
One thing that I think
the general public doesn’t realize
is that prison overall
is actually kind of easy.
You get three meals a day,
you get a roof over your head,
you get a really structured schedule
that’s easy to follow.
A very clear set of rules.
You’ve got the inmate rules,
you’ve got the guard rules,
and you just follow them,
and for the most part,
you know, it’s easy.
Getting released is not easy
because you’ve got
these different variables.
You’ve gotta get a job.
You’ve gotta succeed.
You’ve got people,
you know ,counting on you.
The stress of the whole world,
cars moving around you at a fast pace.
It’s the small things like the day
I got released from prison
I went to my mom’s house
and I was horrified of her dog.
Because the only dogs
you see in prison are K-9 dogs
and they’re not nice,
K-9 dogs are mean as hell.
So my mom had a German Shepherd,
Roscoe was his name. Remember Roscoe?
-I remember.
-Roscoe scared the hell out of me.
Because he was
like a K-9 dog to me and I…
-He was so sweet.
-But I hadn’t been around dogs in years.
It took me a while to get acclimated
back to being around a dog.
But everybody’s a little bit different.
So for him, you know,
he’s really nervous about…
You know, everything it sounds like.
Just like where he’s gonna
go to bed that night,
what he’s gonna do the following day?
Not necessarily where
he’s gonna go to bed.
-He’s got his wife and she owns…
-Oh, okay.
Yeah, he has a wife and she owns
I believe a makeup salon.
-Okay.
-A hair salon.
-So she waited for 12 years?
-She did. Yeah, she waited for 12 years.
-Is that common?
-Uh, it depends
So a Dear John is when you’re
in prison and you get a letter in the mail
I believe it’s the exact
same concept as the military.
You get a letter in the mail that says,
“Danny I’m moving on.” or
Michael, or Chris, or Bob.
“I’m moving on,
I found somebody else.”
And so in prison, Inmates,
we joke about stuff like that.
“Did you get your Dear John today?”
or “Did you get your Dear John yet?”
because sometimes joking is the only way
to deal with those
heavy emotions that, you know,
let’s face it, a lot of guys in prison
aren’t good at dealing with emotions.
Which is a part of the reason
they’re in prison sometimes.
But Dear John’s are a very real thing.
More than half of people in prison
get a Dear John letter
from their significant other
saying “Hey I’m moving on.”
[Michael] A big part of me looks back
and I realized at 19
I’d pretty much thrown everything away.
A switch just flipped in my brain
when I was in prison and I hated it.
I hated the people,
I hated being there,
that I had let my life get to that point,
and I just had
a bunch of hatred, and anger,
and so I used it to change,
and I just started reading and studying,
[Peter] So would you say prison
was a good thing for you?
[Michael] Yeah, 100%.
Looking back the stories are crazy
because they’re so much different
than my life now.
We go to church and we stay home…
-And I want to say to you guys
here in the audience that
these two have a YouTube channel.
They’ve reached out to me.
Thank you guys by the way.
Thank you for reaching back.
But what they do is they actually show up
when prisoners are being released
and going back into society.
-That’s the channel.
-Yep
I’m gonna leave that link below.
The name of the channel?
-Time Served.
-That’s right, and the sweatshirt
obviously Time Served.
So it’s very cool content to see people’s
first reaction coming out from a world…
They don’t know what’s been going on
politically or culturally so much
or do they have TV?
We do have TV in prison
but it doesn’t necessarily mean
you have a good grasp
of the tension in the air.
For example,
like when 2020, and COVID hit
I remember I prayed
thinking like thanking God
that I wasn’t in prison for that
and then praying for the people who were
because you see it on TV, but you have
no context to grasp what’s happening
and being in prison during
the protests, and COVID, and the election,
it had to have added a ton
of anxiety to a lot of people.
-Or would they be like,
“Oh sweet I’m in here.
I’m safe. It’s chill. It’s relaxed.”
Prisoners tend to be
very conspiracy theorists.
They tend to be conspiracy theorists.
So I imagine there was
a lot of talk of the end of the world.
-Why is that?
Because your mind just wanders?
Yeah, maybe your mind wanders or…
Prison is full of eccentric people.
People whose personality
is a little bit different.
I think that’s a driving force
why people end up incarcerated
They don’t relate well
to everybody else.
Even me, I think my brain’s
always been a little bit off
and I don’t know if it’s the ADD or what
but we just we communicate different.
We look at the world different I think.
I’m not much of a conspiracy theorist.
I don’t really pay attention.
I just work and pay my bills.
I try not to worry about stuff
that’s outside of my grasp
-Okay, what about race in prison
because the Whites go with the Whites,
the Mexicans, Blacks, right?
Yep.
-Every prison is like that?
-In Arizona, yes.
You have to fight
for your tribe basically?
Yeah, that’s essentially it.
It starts in county jail because
jail follows the same guidelines.
So when you walk into County,
if it’s your very first time
you will pick a race.
If you’re White you will pick the Whites
if you’re a Mexican–
-What do you mean you pick?
-You can choose.
-Oh, really?
-You can choose.
-A White guy can go with the Blacks?
Yeah. I’ve seen it happen a couple times.
Wouldn’t you just want to go
with the strongest force?
No, not necessarily.
It’s kind of complicated.
But generally the strongest
force in prisons in Arizona
is probably the Mexicans or the White boys
and they tend to have
very, very strict rules.
If a 19 year old White kid gets arrested
and goes to prison in Arizona
and a 19 year old Black kid gets arrested
and goes to prison in Arizona
their experiences are not
going to look the same.
-Okay, how so?
The White boys are extremely structured
very strict rules, they have to pay taxes.
They have to work out at certain times.
-Pay taxes?
-Yeah
If you have a job
or if you have a hustle on the yard
or if your mom sends you money
you have to pay taxes.
-To who?
The head of the building
who then takes it to somebody else.
It goes up the inmate chain
Inmate chain? So there’s a hierarchy?
-There’s like a boss?
-Yeah
There’s essentially somebody
who runs the entire yard.
Somebody who runs the entire complex.
-For each color, for each race?
-Yes.
Sometimes technically
more than one for each race
because there’s factions
within the races as well.
It goes all the way to the top.
Somebody runs the entire state as well.
Okay, so the Whites are highly ordered?
Yeah, very ordered, structured, exactly.
The Mexicans are too?
So are the Mexicans. very strict.
It’s not as serious as a lot of
the movies that depict California prisons.
But it is serious to an extent
that people do get beat up and stabbed.
Maybe not at the same frequency
as you’d see in like, California or Texas
but you have to pick a race
once you pick that race
you stay with that race forever.
You can’t leave.
If you try to leave…[laughs]
You just can’t leave. It’s not possible.
So for example,
I’m half White and half Black.
I ran with the Blacks in prison.
-Why do you go with the Blacks?
I knew a lot of people
had been to prison.
I already knew the basics
for as far as how it works.
And the choice was kind of easy.
Most of my friends
on the streets were Black.
And it honestly was
just like a natural choice.
The White boys are heavily influenced
by, you know, Skinheads,
and the Aryan Brotherhood,
and you don’t want to be
a half Black guy
running with the White boys.
It does happen though.
There was a guy who was
half Black and half White
and he was on the minimum yard
and he ran with the White boys
and they bullied the hell out of him.
I always prided myself
on being very good at prison
because there’s a set of rules
and if you can just master those rules
it’s so easy to skate through prison
and not get into trouble.
You know, don’t get in debt,
don’t get high,
don’t talk crazy about people,
and you know, don’t be a weirdo.
-So most people from the outside never
think of getting into debt in prison.
-Yeah.
-But that’s a common thing?
Yeah, prison is essentially
one large economy.
The entire the only thing
that matters in prisons today…
The rules and the politics
have changed so dramatically
over the last 30 years is money.
Money is all that matters in prison.
There is an economy.
There are people who have hustles
making arts and crafts projects
to sell you so you can send to your mom.
Running a store,
if you need two honey buns,
they’ll give you two
and you give them three back on store day.
Selling shots of coffee or cigarettes,
painting pictures, doing illegal trades.
It’s an entire economy
and everybody in there
has a job or a hustle.
If something happens
that jeopardizes that economy
you piss off everybody in the economy.
So if you get the yard shut down
for doing something stupid
you’re going to get beat up, like bad.
Depending on how long
the yard gets shut down for.
What was really common out here in
Arizona was these kids would smoke spice.
It’s like synthetic marijuana
and they would fall out,
they would like have seizures
Raquel knows ’cause she used to
see him in wheelchairs all day.
-Every day?
-Every day, multiple times a day.
Five to six times a day at least,
especially on minimum yards.
If you’re a shot caller in prison
and you sell some kid spice
and then he falls out and has to get
wheel chaired off to the medical
you’re gonna have him beat up later
even though you sold him the spice.
Because he’s bringing heat to the yard
by falling out and when people fall out,
what are the cops do?
There’s probably spice in that building.
Let’s send in 30 cops and go raid it.
What’s the corruption like
with the cops from what you saw in prison?
Are they part of this economy at all?
Are there bribes being given?
To a to an extent
but probably not the extent
that the audience would imagine.
I think people who’ve
never been to prison,
their imagination runs wild and they think
cops are a major part of it.
They’re not, it does happen, yes.
There are cops that bring in cell phones,
that bring in drugs,
you know do stuff with inmates.
But it’s not like a super
common everyday occurrence.
It does happen but most of the stuff,
it’s done by the inmates themselves.
Okay, but this economy running
throughout all the prisoners,
that’s accepted by the cops?
-No,
-It’s just all underground?
Well, yeah to an extent.
Some of it You can see,
some of it you can’t see.
If you’re new
you’re not gonna see a lot of it.
If you’ve been there for 10 years
you’re gonna catch on to a lot of it.
-Some guys just aren’t that slick.
-So are they trying to bust you guys?
Yeah, they’re always raiding people.
-It’s cat and mouse.
-We’re talking like a cinnamon bun?
Not for that stuff, so for like
running a store selling coffee
the cops aren’t gonna be
trying to get you.
If you’re selling narcotics, spice…
How do narcotics get into prison?
There’s a lot of different ways.
Most of the time it’s visitation.
The cops know this already too.
This is no secret here.
It comes into visitation
or through the outside crews.
Well, okay in the movies visitation,
there’s plexiglass.
Yeah, that’s in county jail.
In prison you’re actually in person.
You can hug them, you know?
You hug someone you
slip something in their pocket?
Drugs in their pocket?
That’s the currency?
Yes, exactly, or outside crews.
Cleaning up the side of highways
and nowadays everything has changed a lot.
This didn’t exist when I was in
but nowadays they just fly drones in
and they just dropped the tennis ball.
And there’ll be somebody on the yard
waiting to catch the ball.
[chuckling]
The cops know all of this.
None of this is a secret
like I’m giving away like insider
information, the cops know all of it.
Mainly because there’s rats on the yard
that tell them everything too
but every year there’s new ways
and they just keep adapting and changing,
and five years from now
it’ll be a whole different way.
They’ll have carrier pigeons trained
or something, I don’t know.
The higher yards, it’s more
expensive to get narcotics
because it’s harder to get them.
Whereas on minimum yards,
they cost a lot less
So if you can get onto a minimum
and smuggle it up to a higher yard…
-Higher security?
-Yeah higher security, exactly.
How many levels are there?
In Arizona, we have two yards
which are minimum,
three yards, which are medium,
you’ll see lifers on three yards.
Four yards, which are high mediums.
This these are you know, dangerous.
And five yards which are
maximum security facilities.
-What’s Eric coming out of tomorrow?
-Eric’s coming off a three yard.
A yard known as Steiner,
all of the yards are named after officers
that have been killed in the line of duty.
That used to be a rumor
and I never believed it
’cause there’s so many
nonsense rumors in the prisons
and when I got out
I actually looked it up and it is true.
Every single yard,
Steiner, Barchi, Bachman, Rast,
they’re all named after officers
that were killed.
-What level were you at?
-I was on a three and a four yard.
I was on the same yard he was on
on the other side of it
but that’s where I started my sentence.
I worked my way down to minimum
in Tucson where I met Raquel.
-Do you have any empathy
or respect for these officers?
Oh yeah, most of the officers
are great people.
Some of them are jerks
but they’re doing a job.
They’re just human beings
trying to make it.
I don’t fault anybody.
I have a lot of respect
for police officers.
I have a respect for law enforcement
and I think it’s a really bad
way to think for guys
who’ve been to prison
to talk down on police
and disrespect them.
I don’t agree with that at all.
I love our law enforcement officers.
I love all of our
first responders, our military.
I think that they go out and they risk
their lives and are some of them corrupt?
Absolutely, but so are some priests.
Do you have any guilt
for your past doings?
Yeah, I did some bad stuff.
I don’t really like talking about
it so much on camera because it was
just horrible stuff.
We tied people up, we scared them,
you know, to the point where
they didn’t know what was gonna
happen in the next 10, 15 minutes.
It was a horrible feeling
to look back on when I was in prison
and think like, “Man, like what did you do
to X amount of families?”.
[Peter] What’s out here?
-This is my house I lived in
for a long time when I was a kid.
-Okay, nice middle-class neighborhood.
-Yeah, we had a good nice house.
So where where were your parents
in all of this during your teen years?
They were working a lot.
They owned a business.
They were always at work and I was
always sneaking out. This is my house.
-Right here?
-Yeah
I grew up in a really good neighborhood,
good childhood, had great parents.
I look back and I think about
it and I always remember…
I just think,
“How did I go down that path?”.
It made no sense.
It made like no sense at all.
-Are they proud of you now?
-Yeah
I have a super good relationship
with my mom and my dad
and we see them a lot,
we talk to them a lot.
They’re very close to us and the kids
and they love the heck out of us.
I don’t want to say
I’m the favorite but I’m close. [laughs]
My little brother’s gonna see that.
Right, okay.
Well Raquel get over here, please
What do you guys feel about tomorrow?
Like you’ve done this before.
What are your thoughts going into this?
Excited. I think we both are.
It’s a whole new story that we’ve
never heard before every time
it’s a whole new story.
-What drives you guys to do this?
For us, I think it’s that
everybody makes mistakes
and from both of us being in prison,
you know, obviously different sides of it
but nonetheless
both of us being in prison,
we saw that in prison it’s not
what the movies make it out to be.
It’s not big scary bad people.
Yes, there are some
big scary bad people in there
but a lot of it’s just normal people.
Most of ’em.
-And here’s a question I have
people like me who’ve
never been to prison.
Maybe they don’t realize
how close they are on that line.
-Yeah.
-People could go
to that side really quickly.
-Is that fair to say?
-Yes, snap of a finger honestly.
I’ve seen a lot of people go to prison
for situations that, you know,
just poor decision-making
or accidents that just happen.
-Okay
Well, you guys are picking me up early
tomorrow morning in my hotel, right?
-We’ll be there around 6:30.
-And he’s cool with being on video?
-He agreed to that?
-Yeah, he’s 100% in.
-He’s ready to rock and roll.
-Wow.
[phone recording] To accept
this called press one.
Hi Eric, this is Raquel
and Michael’s here too.
Here’s Michael, he wanted
to ask you a couple things.
We just we just wanted to make sure
that we had everything in place.
We’re gonna be there early in the morning.
-Okay, I’ll be ready.
I’m just full of emotions right now
out of how excited I just feel.
Get some rest tonight.
Try to sleep if you can I know it’s hard.
-I haven’t been able to sleep for
the past two days I’ve just been like
I’ve just been like tossing and turning.
[inaudible] I’m only 25 hours away.
25 hours? Okay.
I counted my hours too
down for my last four days I think.
-You know what’s so crazy?
The last 45 days are basically
the worst days of the whole time there.
-Yeah.
-It’s like everything’s happening.
The more you try to stay away
from everybody and everything
It’s like they’re jumping onto you,
you know what I mean? Literally.
-I’m talking about negativity.
-Yeah.
I just been real distant
trying to push away.
Well, it’s it’s all over now, buddy.
So it’s time to it’s time
to come home and conquer.
-Yeah, that’s true.
Do you have anything you want us
to bring with us in the car,
any requests or anything?
-I have no request.
Thank you, I do appreciate it.
I’m okay, I don’t need nothing.
I do appreciate you and your wife
taking the time to hear me out.
That’s more of a blessing than anything.
Speaking to your wife,
it’s not that I was trying to be rude.
It’s just for 12 years
I wasn’t able to speak to another woman.
No friend, wives, or anything.
Being around the same people
for the past 12 years.
I understand.
You’re good man,
remember she knows the system too.
She used to be a corrections officer, so…
You still there?
These phones are not great.
You still there?
-So those are prison phones?
-It’s a tablet.
-It’s an actual a little clear tablet.
-So someone in can call out at any time?
Yeah, they just unlocked it
like six months ago
where you can call whoever you want.
All the calls are recorded…
Eric can you hear me?
We’ll shoot him a text message.
We’ll see him in a few hours. [chuckles]
You know his feeling right now?
Yeah, it’s crazy.
It’s a crazy feeling when I got out…
So one common thing that
happens when you get out…
Do you know what happens
when they get out? They get beat up.
Yeah, all your buddies will beat you up.
It’s like a ritual.
They’ll beat the shit out of you.
In a fun brotherly love way or what?
Yeah, but you’ll have
some lumps and bruises.
Especially the White boys.
Yeah, AJ and a bunch of them beat me up.
AJ’s still my buddy today
like we’re friends to this very day.
-Geez.
-[laughing] Yeah.
The night before you get out they’ll
tell you to come roll up that night.
At 9 o’clock at night
the guard will come tell you,
“Bryant you’re rolling up,
get your property together.”
And then your buddies will
all come over and they’ll beat you up
or like I cooked burritos to celebrate.
-You think he’s gonna get beat up tonight?
No, I think Eric is
kind of like staying away.
I don’t think he has like large groups
of friends because of his political past
but it’s possible.
Okay, what is he in for?
I believe he’s in for robberies
and we generally don’t ask.
I don’t know why.
We screen them for certain charges
to make sure they’re not against
anything for kids
or molestation or anything.
We never pick those people up
but I think robbery most of the people
we get a robbery or drugs.
So he said, which was very interesting,
he’s been around
the same people for 12 years.
Yeah, pretty much.
-The same kinds of people.
-That has to get exhausting.
Especially for…
and I don’t mean this in a racist way,
but the Mexicans are
a very intense group of people in prison
and so to be…
You spend your time with your own race
so to be around, you know,
a very political group of people
like that for 12 years,
it can get stressful, it can get…
There’s a lot of anxiety involved.
Especially because these
organizations will go to war
against each other
and then you’re stuck in that.
-If you’re in there’s no way out.
-Right.
Well, I’ll give him
some gringo time tomorrow.
-[laughter]
-No problem there.
Well awesome guys, this is a first for me.
We’re excited,
this is gonna be a cool one, so…
[Peter] That is absolutely huge.
[Michael] This is a big prison,
Buckeye’s huge.
-What’s the reputation with Buckeye?
[Michael] It’s a very dangerous prison.
It’s like the prison of prisons.
-So you’re saying these guards
are a little tougher?
Yeah, they can be, some of them are nice.
I think that’s Rast, that’s
a step-down yard for ex-gang members.
-So in there. Are you getting
job training, psychological help?
Are you getting all these services
or what goes on?
Not so much psychological help
but definitely job training.
There’s guys that are learning welding,
automotive repair, engine repair.
-So they have shops in there?
Yeah, surprisingly in fact
Swift Trucking is headquartered here
and they train inmates to pretty much
fix every single aspect of the trucks.
This is the helipad, so if somebody gets
beat up really bad or stabbed really bad
this is where the helicopter
will pick them up.
Every time we’d see a helicopter
we knew somebody
had gotten hurt really bad
and we were probably going
to end up on lockdown.
-How often did that happen?
Maybe every three or four days,
to be honest.
Yeah, Buckeye was kind of crazy.
A lot of these yards,
they’re so close to each other,
especially here in Buckeye.
when they mace one yard the wind
will carry the mace to the next yard
You’ll be minding your business
in your yard
then you’ll just get
hit with a face full of mace.
It sucks.
[Peter] So, this is where we wait?
They told us to come over here
and they drop them off on a bus?
-Yeah, they’ll bring them up on a Van.
So each of these is
a different prison inside of a prison.
So you have one, two, three,
four, five, six prisons here.
And then over here
I believe is Swift Trucking.
-Yeah, you can see all the semis.
-Okay.
And that’s where
the inmates fix the trucks.
This yard right here is Steiner.
-So these yards never mix?
-No, these are different custody levels.
So this is a three-yard.
This is a four-yard.
-How many people
in each yard would you say?
-About 1,000.
-Okay.
Yeah, so right here, you’re looking at
about 6,000 inmates in this complex.
And this is where Eric’s at,
this is Steiner.
So in fact if you look over here,
that’s Morey, and that’s the guard tower.
And that’s where the longest
prison standoff hostage situation
in the United States took place.
They kidnapped a lady for like 30 days
and kept her in there in 2004.
So a lot of these yards
switch back and forth.
At the time this was
a sex offenders yard, Morey,
and then it’ll turn into
a general population yard.
You have general population,
sex offenders,
protective custody, et cetera.
-When you were in,
how many books did you read?
-I probably read about 800 books.
I used to have a list of books
that I had read.
And I stopped counting around like 530.
-And you studied Arabic, right?
I studied Arabic, Spanish,
anything I could get my hands on.
-Can you speak some Arabic?
[Arabic]
-Can you read it?
[Arabic] is good morning.
I speak modern standard Arabic
which is like the… it’s not a colloquial.
It’s the Arabic you’d use in the news.
Yeah, I can read it pretty well.
I read it much better than I speak it.
My speaking is, like, I don’t use it, so…
This is Eric’s wife.
-Oh, okay.
-She just pulled up.
-Hello. Good morning.
-Hi.
I was kind of lost.
-Should we get out?
-Yeah.
-I’m Brianda, nice to meet you.
-How you doing?
-Ooh, it’s cold.
Hello, I’m Michael. Nice to meet you.
-And Peter Santanello.
-Nice to meet you.
-Wow. How are you feeling right now?
-I’m nervous.
I bet.
Wouldn’t be able to sleep anyways.
You got off at work at 2?
-Headed over here, slept a couple hours?
-Yeah.
Okay, so when Eric went in
how old were you?
-I believe I was like 19. Basically–
-We have a release Van. This is it.
Okay.
-Yeah?
-I think so.
-Good morning.
-Good morning, sir.
-Who are you guys here to pick up?
-Eric Reynoso?
They’ll be on their way now.
-Okay, thank you.
-Good thing I was here.
-Yeah.
-[chuckling]
Oh, they’re going to pick them up
and bring him to us.
-They’re gonna pick him up now? Okay.
-I thought he was in there.
I did too. They’re gonna grab him
and bring him over to us.
-That’s not him is it?
-Yeah.
Oh, that’s him?
[Eric] Hey.
How you doing?
[Michael] That’s a crazy feeling isn’t it?
Twelve years.
-Hey, Mike, how you doing?
-Hey, Eric, Peter.
-Congrats, man. Wow.
-Nice to meet you.
-Welcome.
-What’s up, brother?
-Eric.
-Michael.
Nice to meet you.
-Hi, Raquel.
-Eric.
-How you guys doing?
-Good, how are you? [laughter]
-[Peter] How are you doing?!
-[Eric] Um…
Nervous to be out. You know, excited.
-I bet.
-To see what’s going on, you know?
[Peter] Wow.
-Oh, man. You guys…
-[laughter]
I’m shaking. I’m excited.
I’m going to grab your stuff for you
so it doesn’t get run over.
-Thank you.
-You’re good.
-[Peter] Freezing out here isn’t it?
-Yeah, it is.
-So can we jump in the car?
-[laughter]
[Michael] Do you want to spend
a couple minutes with Brianda alone?
-Please.
-Yeah, yeah.
So Eric drives with us
and we meet Brianda in Tucson?
-Yeah.
You were there when murder Morey?
[Michael] Yeah, I was there
in 2010 and ’11.
So, not even like a week ago,
we were out late at night,
chillin’ right there in the…
I was drinking a cup of coffee.
It was like around 7:00 at night
and some guy, I’m not going to
say a name, but some guy pulled up.
and of course, the gangs got together
and they were talking.
They separated
and like 20 minutes later
another guy comes and hits that guy
and then 12 people jump on him.
And while they’re jumping on him,
the whole yard is singing “Happy Birthday”
’cause the guy is
literally screaming for officers.
Screaming, literally screaming.
I was just sitting down.
What can I do? You know what I mean?
I’d be one against the whole yard.
The whole yard’s in it.
-Do they still lock you
on the yards there?
No, not control movement anymore.
Now it’s free.
-Oh, it’s open?
-It’s open yard now.
-Oh, I’ve never seen Steiner open.
-Yeah.
-That yard’s too dangerous to be open.
-Exactly… Now it’s open yard.
-That’s crazy.
[Peter] What happened to the guy?
Um…
He got beat up by 12 people
and he got stuck 12 times, you know?
And they left him there
and they found him like 20 minutes later.
-Yeah, those are about
the worst yards there are in the state.
Yeah, and the officers
lost control of that yard.
It’s the inmates
who run the yard now, you know?
Of course money talks, you know?
Of course, there’s corruption everywhere.
It’s sad, you know?
[Peter] So you say the officers
lost control of the yard?
Like they just stay
in their little safe spaces?
They know. Basically, they step in.
Yeah, they got the badge and everything
but they don’t have that power no more,
you know what I mean?
Like they lost that power of that yard.
-When did they lose that?
How many years ago?
[Eric scoffs and chuckles]
I’m going to say about a year ago.
-Okay.
-Once the politics hit hard in that yard.
You know what I mean?
Once there’s somebody…
Of course, I’m not going to say a name.
Somebody hit that yard
and he’s somebody, you know what I mean?
And that somebody has money and power,
you know what I mean?
He runs part of the state,
you know what I mean?
I ran with the Surenos
and automatically with the Surenos,
we don’t have a choice.
We can’t run civilian
because it ain’t our backyard,
and since we have so many little numbers
it’s automatically we’re in the mix.
Like if you say,
“Hey, I don’t want to be in it…”, bet.
All right, cool, all right.
And then people knock on your door
and you’re getting shipped out.
So you don’t have a say so.
It’s automatically you’re running Sureno.
-What do you mean running Sureno?
What does that mean?
Southern United Raza,
back at home, back where I’m from.
I say back at home because I’m from
California, so I say back at home.
And the Surenos were basically
disciplined, you know what I mean?
And since I went in at a young age
and they seen the opportunity to break me
and rebuild me their way.
-Oh, okay.
-So basically they broke me.
Mentally-wise, they broke me,
but rebuilt me, you know what I mean?
In their way.
-Like the military, maybe?
-Exactly like the military.
Your mind, your thoughts and everything,
it’s all serve, serve, serve.
You’re a soldier, you know what I mean?
-So like in a situation like his,
he doesn’t have a choice.
Whereas like for me, because of my race,
I don’t have to do anything.
So we could be on the same exact yards,
but have two different experiences.
Kinda what I was telling you earlier.
Like me, I wasn’t involved
in politics at all because I’m Black.
We don’t have the same types of politics
for our race in the prisons here.
So even me being in prison seven years,
I don’t know anything about his world
because they don’t talk to us about it.
Like we see it,
we know a little bit, but not in detail.
-So do your worlds ever come together?
Yeah, like we’ll hang out
at the poker table.
We’ll talk a little bit
but you can only talk so much.
Like we know how it works.
Like we understand their politics.
We just… ours are different.
You know, we’re not as active as they are,
it’s a different world for us.
And the White boys are the same way
as the Mexicans, extremely structured.
They’ve got a much deeper
political system.
with the Blacks,
we have almost no politics. Almost none.
[Peter] So it’s better
to be Black in prison?
Yeah.
-If I had a choice, I would’ve done it.
If I would’ve known since the beginning,
I woulda done it.
-Changed your color?
-I woulda changed my color, straight up.
I would’ve grown a ‘fro, done everything.
I would’ve been like, “Hey, I’m straight.”
I woulda sagged my pants.
Let’s roll, you know?
We have no rules, no politics.
We can just do our time and go home.
Exactly, they have a choice.
They have a choice.
They ask you when you get there,
are you going to run civilian?
-Are you going to what?
-Run civilian.
Civilian means you’re in prison
but you don’t want
nothing to do with politics.
You’re just doing your time
and you’re going home
or you’re going to join the family.
As a Sureno, since we’re,
like I said, so little numbers,
they want every single
head and soul they could get
that comes into prison
that’s from California just in case.
Because there’s times
where we have a dispute
with the Mexicans,
the AZs, and we have a dispute
with the Aryan Brotherhood
or the Natives,
and we have to have numbers.
And they make us work out and everything
so we could be in shape
and prepared for war.
In the morning is when we do our burpees,
113 burpees to start off, the warm up,
and then we do an hour of workout.
And in the afternoon,
we just do an hour of workout.
Okay, so if you’re, say,
your average White,
you could have a choice
to be in the political world?
-Yeah.
-Why would someone join
if it seems more stressful?
Why would they choose to join that?
-Just to have more protection?
-No.
The gang offers you
a chance to be somebody.
-Exactly.
-Oh, okay. Acceptance?
There’s a lot of people
that doesn’t know what love is.
[Michael] Exactly, yeah.
-That’s the main thing.
-They’ve never been part of something.
Yes.
-The gang can make
you somebody powerful
and they’ve never had that.
[Eric] And they embrace you.
They show you the love
that the streets didn’t give you
or your family didn’t give you.
They help you out.
Let’s say like us,
when I first got there, of course,
the first few weeks you get there,
you can’t shop and everything.
So they bring you your shoes,
toothpaste, toothbrush, hygiene kit.
That’s what the kitty is,
the hygiene kit, shampoo, all that stuff.
And in the streets, nobody does that.
So right away, they show you the love.
They embrace you, like,
“Come here, you’re family.”
-Right, right.
That’s how people
get caught up into the things
and then basically, they give you power.
Power.
Imagine, they give you power
to run… a whole yard.
That’s 200 and something people that you
have power over. You know what I mean?
Like you say, “Hey, go do this.”
-And it becomes addictive, right?
-It’s an addiction.
The power is an addiction.
This will probably be
the last stop before Tucson, so…
-I’ll chill right here.
-Okay.
-You want me to grab you anything?
-Just a Dr. Pepper.
Dr. Pepper? Okay.
Eric, have you seen all this stuff–
-This is for Eric I’m assuming.
-Yeah, that’s from me actually.
Oh, yeah? Thank you very much.
-Oh my God, I left it at the house.
-That’s all right.
-I’m have to mail it to you.
-Eric, have you seen phones like this?
-I ain’t never. [laughs] No, I did not.
When I got locked up, it was like,
remember the… I had a Razr.
Remember the Razrs?
-Remember the little one?
-The Sidekick?
Yeah, yeah, the Sidekick.
That was the closest I got.
-Like, you’ve seen them on TV, right?
Yeah, I’ve seen them on TV.
or I’ve seen officers
when they’ll have phones like that.
They’ll carry the phones.
-But have you been on Instagram
or any of those platforms?
No, no.
-Nothing?
-No, I know what Facebook is.
You know what I mean? I had a Facebook.
-What about YouTube?
-I’ve been on YouTube.
Yeah, ’cause I used to have,
like, a little Jolly phone.
[Michael] He shoots
documentaries in like some of
the worst hoods in the country.
How do you walk through
South side Chicago
and people don’t think you’re a cop?
-‘Cause you look like a cop.
-You do look like a cop.
I thought when you were shooting, like,
“A cop? Do I have a warrant?”
You know what I mean?
Is that what you wanted coming out
to be right next to a cop-looking dude?
Yeah, that’s what I thought.
I’m all like, “Is this a cop?”.
Am I being pranked right now?
You get out of prison, and it looks like
an Aryan Brotherhood sitting next to you.
-[laughter]
-Do I look like one of those guys?
I um…
-I need more tattoos or something?
Yeah, the only time I’ll be able to
sit next to different races
was at the poker table.
Just poker table, that’s it.
-Pretty much it, yeah.
-Other than that, we weren’t allowed–
-We could play Spades.
-Oh, you know how to play spades?
-Yeah.
Other than that, we weren’t allowed
to sit next to each other.
In the chow hall they have Mexicans,
Indians, Surenos, and Blacks.
-You’re not allowed to cross–
-[Michael] Or walk between.
Or walk between at all.
And that could start a riot.
[Michael] If you walk between tables
you’re in trouble.
-How do the Indians do in prison?
-The Indians, um…
They’re crazy… Oh, man… Oh, man!
[mumbles in disbelief]
Respect. That’s all I gotta say, respect.
[Peter] Respect to them?
-They’re the smallest group,
and they’re the craziest.
-War society? Oh, my God.
There’s two major gangs
in the Arizona prisons
of Native Americans
and they hate each other.
-One of them is the War Society.
They can’t even be on the same yards.
Like, they’ll…
They won’t put them on
the same yards, Warrior Society and Diné.
-Is it like Navajos and everyone else?
-Something like that.
-Diné and everyone else.
-Yeah, Diné versus everybody else.
[Eric] They would literally put,
like you said, those two in the same yard,
and you hear the calls, when they start
singing their calls, the warrior call.
Like they have a song, a warrior song.
Literally they will attack each other
and they will stab each other to death.
They are… savage. Savage.
-They’re no joke.
-They’re no joke.
-So everyone fears them?
-They’re feared.
They’re a little number
but they’re very feared.
‘Cause they will not stop.
[Peter] Why do you think race is
such a big thing in prison? What is that?
-It’s ’cause it’s to keep structure.
To keep structure and balance in prisons.
You know what I mean?
‘Cause if there’s no politics
then it’ll be crazy
and it’ll be a disaster.
And let’s say like when they made
the Mexican Mafia,
they say stories, the Whites, the Blacks,
were taking advantage of the Mexicans.
You know what I mean? They were
extorting them, everything like that.
So that’s why the Mexican united
and became a family
and started the Mexican Mafia.
-Okay.
You agreed to do this, which is very cool,
’cause it’s, I don’t think,
an easy thing to do.
-No, it’s not.
But the reason behind that,
you were just saying off-camera.
What is that? Why do you want to do this?
If I could at least help one person,
you know what I mean, teenager,
to not fall into this life
’cause as fun as it sounds,
as cool as it looks… it’s not.
Once you live it, it’s not what you think.
It’s not.
Now it’s all about money,
you know what I mean?
It’s not what it used to be.
Like now they’ll use you,
chew you up, and spit you right back out.
And I respect the politics.
I respect them all, you know what I mean?
But like I’ve always done for 12 years,
I will speak the truth
and tell the truth, always.
And if there’s consequences,
there’s consequences.
But the truth must be told,
the story, you know what I mean?
I gave up,
I caught a year and a half for them,
and like I said, I respect them,
and I’ll always respect them.
But it’s not what it used to be, you know?
Like, they will tell you, literally,
“Go stab your best friend.”
‘Cause he has two months to the gate
just because he doesn’t want
to do something when he’s served 20 years.
You know what I mean?
And that wasn’t right, you know?
And we’ve committed our time,
committed our lives to this.
Yeah.
-So the attraction for you
when you were younger
was probably that belonging, right?
And there’s an excitement to it, right?
There’s adrenaline. Adrenaline that
you can’t get off of nowhere.
No drug, nothing can give you
that high, that adrenaline.
-What was your crime
if you don’t mind me asking?
First-degree burglary
with a deadly weapon.
-Okay, so robbing is like this
adrenaline of you’re gonna get something,
there’s consequences.
-I used to go rob the dope boys.
-Dope boys?
I used to be the one,
if I came knocking on your door,
it’s go time, you knew what time it is.
Like, I was known.
If I come knocking on your door,
I didn’t care if you had guns,
I didn’t care what you have.
If me and my squad came, it’s coming.
-You were going after drug dealers?
-Yeah, I’d go after drug dealers.
-Okay, so that was your thing.
-Yeah, home invasions, armed robbery.
-So it was just drug dealers?
Just drug dealers, I didn’t–
-‘Cause you knew
they had the money or why?
I…
I’mma tell you a quick story.
So I had this prosecutor,
I’m not gonna say a name.
He convicted me,
it was my first time and I told him,
We went to a settlement conference
and I begged him.
I’m all like, this is my first offense,
I’m all like, give me a chance.
And I remember
he looked at me and he said,
“People like you,
I’m gonna put away forever.”
And I told him it was my first offense,
I told him, and I begged him.
So what I did,
this was the only guy I went after.
I found out where he lived.
Then I literally
went to his house and I sat there
and I broke into his house,
and waited for him to get home.
When I came knocking to your door,
the old me, that’s the old me,
you know what I mean?
-Wow.
And I got a reputation in prison for that.
If I came knocking on your door in prison
it was ’cause you were
about to get shipped out.
So they, like I said, they broke me,
you know what I mean?
And they rebuilt me, and they knew,
like, the person they built,
the machine,
basically I don’t take credit for it.
And, like I said, that’s the old me.
That person died
and was left in those gates.
-When did he die, just this morning?
-He died a year ago.
-A year ago?
-Yes, he died a year ago.
And I was reborn again.
That’s why I wouldn’t be sitting here
if I wasn’t born, you know what I mean?
-I wouldn’t be trying to help others.
-Reborn, as in you became religious?
Yes, became religious.
I gave myself, you know what I mean?
I was saved.
This is the only reason why I’m
doing this, you know what I mean?
The old me, and of course,
I asked permission first
before I came out,
if I could do it. I had to.
-You asked permission?
-Yes.
-From who?
-From…
-Everyone on the inside?
-Yes, the people I was under.
I won’t give names.
-They gave you the approval?
-They gave me approval.
That’s what I’m saying. I don’t say names
but I could just speak so far.
-That’s what I was saying,
if there’s anything
you don’t want on camera let me know.
-‘Cause I don’t want anything…
-No, I got the okay.
Of course, I had to ask permission,
’cause I’m gonna be staying in Tucson,
and they’re gonna know where I’m at.
They got people that work in the courts,
you know what I mean?
-What do you mean?
-How does it work?
Let’s say, I wanna find you.
I’m in prison, and I wanna find you.
When people are gonna get released,
they give you a list,
you know what I mean?
And if you’re committed,
serve your gang, you know what I mean?
When you get out to the
streets, it doesn’t end.
It doesn’t end when you get out the gates.
It’s a career, you live forever.
If you’re committed
and you’re trying to reach the stars,
you’re trying to reach the top,
like all the way,
where you could be able
to run a whole state.
-Can we talk about that for Peter’s video,
for the hierarchy of the state?
-Yeah, this is all new.
-Are you allowed to talk about that?
-Like what?
The head of the state,
complex, the yard, the buildings.
I can’t give names.
-No, I know that,
just how the hierarchy works.
-How taxes go all the way up to the–
Okay, yeah.
Like, what do you wanna know?
-How does the power work?
How does the hierarchy work?
Okay, well the ranks, like the military.
-Like everything, right?
You got the corporal,
you got the sergeant,
you got the lieutenant,
you got the captain.
And it goes forward,
the treasurer, forward, up, up, up.
-So each race has their rank in their–
Each race has their own ranks,
their own rules,
and their own penalties.
Like for us, for instance, for Los Renos,
our penalties is, first one,
you do 1,300 burpees.
Stands for trece.
Trece stands for the M.
M stands for the Mexican Mafia.
Like, the Surenos
will always run with the old M.
The mano negra, from back at home.
That’s California.
You know, our main people
are back at the bay
in the high, in the maxes,
you know what I mean?
Or in the feds, in the feds.
It’s nothing but Surenos all around.
-In the federal prisons?
-Yeah, the federal prison.
So we run differently.
Ours is 1,300 burpees, first discipline.
The second one, you’ll have three
people go in on you for 13 seconds.
-Just beat you up for 13 seconds?
-Beat you up.
-Three people?
-Three people.
-A lot can happen in that time.
-Anything can happen.
Anything can happen.
-With weapons?
-No, hands.
And you cannot fold up.
If you fold up they’ll make you
get right back up and you go again.
-You can never fold up.
-You’ve been through that?
No, ’cause I’ve never…
Like I said, I was a…
People like me, we’re super Surenos.
Super Surenos is we were committed
and we will follow every rule.
We will not break.
Like I said, I committed in my life.
I was committed to it.
-Okay, gotcha. Okay, what’s the third?
The third rule, there is no third rule.
You’re done.
You don’t have a third rule.
That’s life, you have no third rule.
There’s only two rules.
The third one, you’re done.
So that’s how it goes.
That’s why the Surenos in the prisons are
most respected for how disciplined we are.
You know what I mean?
And how straight we walk.
We always walk
with our head high in the yard.
We’re always prepared for war
and that’s why we always
carry shanks with us at all times.
And literally,
if a Sureno comes and says,
“Let me see your shank,” and you don’t
have it, you’re in trouble.
-So you can walk around
with a shank all day long?
-All day long.
-The security officers don’t know?
Let’s say a security officer comes
and tries to check you,
and you know you have a shank,
you’re going to tell the homie,
“I’m walking hot.”
And the homie’s
going to distract the officer
or the officer tries to
cause an ICS on you,
then the inmate automatically
has to take flight on the officer.
So you don’t get caught with anything.
[Michael] Take flight means to fight.
-Fight the officer?
-Yeah, fight the officer.
So you could run and throw everything.
-What’s your feeling about the officers?
Now, like, I respect them,
you know what I mean?
I respect… before I didn’t respect them.
Now I respect them.
-Now, as in the last year
when you found God?
Yes, when I found God
I started to respect them. My eyes opened.
They just come and get their paycheck.
-How’d you find God?
Um, my…
My girl, she… she has a brain tumor.
-Oh, man. I’m sorry.
She has a brain tumor.
And when I found out, I just…
At first I had lost all…
I was going crazy
’cause imagine being in prison,
not being able to do nothing.
-You’re gonna feel worthless.
-Yeah.
Not being able to be there for her.
The time she’s sick,
the time she’s in the hospital,
the time she’s going through pain,
you can’t do nothing.
You can’t do nothing.
And so who’s the only person
you’re going to turn to?
God.
I mean I submitted,
you know what I mean?
I submitted and asked him, like,
it’s in your hands, you know what I mean?
In the Bible it says
you got the power to heal.
Doctors could say this,
doctors could say that,
but only he gots the power to heal.
He gots the last word.
-Did you ever think when you
were younger you would become religious?
-Never in a million years.
-[Peter chuckles]
Never in a million years.
I… before I turned my life to God
I used to be into dark stuff.
I used to be into real dark stuff.
I was into Santa Muerte,
all that stuff, you know what I mean?
‘Cause I basically… and excuse my
word God, for saying this,
but I hated it.
I hated them ’cause I said,
“Why’d you take my freedom?
Why’d you take everything away from me?”
And for years I had a grudge.
I had a grudge towards him.
Once I found out, like I said,
my girl had a brain tumor.
That’s when I said, “I’m done.
If you want me to serve, I’ll serve.
If you want me to help people, I’ll help.”
I feel that’s my duty.
[Peter] It’s super interesting
both you guys went in for the same thing.
-[Michael] Yeah.
-And you could justify it easily.
You were saying that off-camera
because you were taking out drug dealers.
You were saying about kid zones.
Yeah, like my thing is
I would like to get hits
that were drug dealers
selling in kid zones
and selling to underage kids.
Getting them addicted to it.
‘Cause I hated that. I always hated that.
So if I knew he was
selling to kids and everything,
and during my surveillance time
when I was getting ready
and I see him selling to kids,
then with more reason, I’ll do it.
And I’ll make sure I pistol-whip him.
There was no robbing
old ladies on the street?
No, no, like if they work,
no, I would never hurt an old lady.
Women, I respect.
-There’s a code on the streets.
You can’t do that.
Like, you can’t just, like,
beat up an old lady.
-You’re gonna, like–
-So who does that stuff?
-Crazy people.
-Crackheads.
-Crackheads, yeah, crazy people.
-Lowlifes.
[Peter] Okay, so the people on the drugs
are robbing your average person
in society.
-Yeah, a lot of the times that’s the case
or there’s, like, one-offs.
So Eric was, like, in the life,
and even though I was never affiliated,
I was in that life, too.
So, like, when you’re in that life,
you can’t go rob an old lady.
‘Cause you’re in that life. People know
who you are. You’re around other people.
If they’re like,
“Dude, you robbed some old lady.”
they’re gonna beat you up for that.
-Yeah.
-At least beat you up, right?
-At the bare minimum.
-Yeah.
I try to justify to myself too that
hey, these are drug dealers,
and who cares?
and they’re not gonna call the cops.
But either way
it still causes a lot of trauma
’cause sometimes
their wives are in the house
and it causes a lot of trauma to them too.
I always felt horrible for that when
I got to prison and I looked back at it.
But is it different than
robbing old ladies? Yes. Right?
These guys are not innocent
and they know what business they’re in.
They know what… You know?
-So you could justify it easily?
-Yeah.
“I’m gonna take out
this guy selling drugs.”
Yeah, I’mma jack his ass
you know what I mean?
For selling to kids I’mma jack his ass.
I would target those people.
-Did you make a lot of money
back in the day?
Did I make a lot of money?
I made a ridiculous money.
Before I was a jackboy, I used to traffic.
I mean, I used to traffic
to North Carolina, south to the Jamaicans.
I was, like 16 years old
you know what I mean?
I would go to Mexico
and close down the club.
I mean, I was spending money
for stupid… like, stupid.
Like having money,
I would go to the store,
buy anything I want,
you know what I mean?
Like, it was a good life but was it worth
it to take away a decade away from me?
No, it was not.
When I sat in that cell
and thought about it, it was not worth it.
I should have sat my ass down
and worked a real job.
I did the convict career.
Did I like it? No, I did not.
I did it 12 years. Did I like it?
I hanged that jacket
when that gate closed.
My job in prison, so everybody
has their own thing that you’re taught.
I was taught to be aware,
and read people’s body language,
and read people.
That was my job, you know what I mean?
Like to be, when somebody is lying
or some body language.
That was my job to do.
-You can sense that in
a half second, right?
In a half second.
That’s what I was taught to do.
-Your emotional intelligence
is through the roof?
Like, you can read any scene.
I’ll be able to.
I could sense this person’s all bad.
Like, this person’s no good, he’s lying.
Read his body language, his eye contact,
looking to the left, to the right,
not keeping eye contact.
Okay, so there was another group
you’re saying, in prison,
guys that had boobs.
-They didn’t all have boobs.
There were some that would
come from the streets,
and they’re, like, legitimate.
Look like a straight female,
but they weren’t able to be in the yard
’cause they are, like,
the most dramatic people in the world.
You know what I mean?
The most dramatic.
Like, “Oh, my God.”
You know what I mean?
-They cause fights too.
-Yes.
Yeah, they’re called Cheetos,
Cheetos are homosexuals in prison
and they cause fights
and like Eric said, drama.
They were just nightmares.
-So that what they say, you be like,
“Hey, better get out of here.”
Like, to prevent drama and riots.
You know what I mean?
-And there’s no such thing
as, like, consensual…
It’s against the inmate rules
and against the guard rules.
So two inmates, if they’re both gay,
they’re not allowed to do anything.
If they get caught, like, it happens.
You’re getting air evacted.
-You’ll get your face kicked in.
-Kicked in.
-So what we see in the movies with that,
totally incorrect?
It’s incorrect. It’s false.
-What, as far as rape?
-Yeah, yeah.
You’re not going into the bathroom
and worrying about things?
No, it’s false but like rape is true.
-Sex offender yards but that’s
a different… You know?
I can’t tell you that, sir,
’cause I don’t know about that.
Or maybe it was more so back in the ’90s.
That’s why the Mexican Mafia started,
you know what I mean?
The Southern United Raza,
’cause Mexicans were getting raped
by the Whites, by the Blacks.
-Oh.
-That’s why they united.
‘Cause the Mexicans were the ones
that were being taken advantage of.
-Makes sense.
That’s why it started the family.
-And I’ve always heard
that’s why in Arizona
all the races are against the Blacks
is because back in the ’90s…
-There was a lot of extortion.
-They were the ones doing the raping.
I wasn’t in prison in the ’90s
but that was always the stories
we heard while we were incarcerated.
-That what I was told too.
[Peter] Mad about what? I’m sorry?
DOC, they don’t give you classes.
Like, you know how quick they are
to take away your freedom?
But they’re quick enough…
Yeah, you do your time
but they just throw you out right there.
Like, right now, “Here, get off the van,
here’s your box, let’s go.”
-Yeah, getting released,
there’s nothing for you.
They don’t give you classes to program
yourself back to society, new faces.
I mean…
-There’s no programs that you
have access to or anything like that?
No.
-They didn’t give you a sheet like,
“Here’s who you call.”?
Oh, yeah, yeah.
They give us in the outside, but I’m
saying prepare you in the inside.
Like let’s say when I got locked up
the prices weren’t high.
Remember when milk
cost you like $2.75?
-How much does it cost now?
-Four or five bucks.
-You see how…
-It’s like $7, isn’t it?
Yeah.
-You’re going to see that real quick.
-Yes.
-The last couple of years have been rough,
it’s been getting very expensive.
It looks like I’m cool and calm right now
but inside I’m literally
freaking out right now.
I’m not lying, I’m freaking out.
I’m just trying to hold myself calm.
-[Michael] Cybertruck. That’s Elon Musk.
-[giggling]
What the…
-Oh, wow. Yeah, you’ve
never seen the Cybertruck.
I’m surprised
there’s a Cybertruck in Tucson.
I’m surprised that car exists.
-It’s electric.
-Yeah, and they’re pretty pricey.
-What do you mean electric?
-Plug it into the wall.
I can get an extension cord
and plug it in?
Yeah, pretty much.
What the f*ck? That looks like a tank.
You’ve seen that? That’s crazy.
How do things look to you so far?
I just seen a tank in the street.
That’s… Oh, man.
[sighs]
Hey, Peter, pinch me, man.
Am I dreaming? I’m not dreaming.
This is interesting. So in
prison, these are the shoes.
-These are the shoes. Rollins?
-Rollins.
These jeans, I thought that was
a Chicano look you were rocking.
No, I don’t wear baggy clothes.
I wear fitted clothes.
Okay, so they give you these jeans?
They give you these
and they give you… the blue.
That’s why it’s called the blues.
-Oh.
It’s the blue set.
I could have got the deck shoes too,
the blue deck shoes
but I came out with the Rollins.
It’ll be a souvenir for you.
So you guys said you wanted
to get him new clothes
’cause these are prison clothes.
-We always take people to get clothes.
What about you, Eric? Do you want
to rock these or are you done with them?
-I’m done with the DOC man.
-Nobody wants to rock…
You do not want to be seen walking…
Then people start judging.
Everybody here knows what the blues are.
They’ll see it and they’ll know
he just got released.
-Gotcha.
-We usually get clothes first.
-I’ve been judged for 12 years.
-Wherever you guys want to go.
[Michael] Here’s his prison I.D.
Oh, the prison I.D.
That’s what they look like?
Yeah, be careful,
it has a social on there.
Gotcha.
My Bible of course, I’ve been through.
I’ve had that Bible with me a long time.
[Michael] Yeah.
-Here are those. That’s for you.
And look, look.
Yeah, that’s what I was waiting for.
Do these only exist in prison?
You can get other variations.
-But this one only comes in prison.
-And this is for you.
-Oh, cool. Thank you.
-Thank you.
You were living off that stuff for years?
I used to eat two of these every
day with peanut butter on top,
put them in the microwave
because each one is like 600 calories.
So if you’re working out…
-Oh, thank you.
-No problem.
I thought about you, too. Don’t worry
about it. You know what I mean?
[chuckling]
They didn’t tell me how many people
were coming so I had made rings.
[Peter] Oh, that’s cool.
I do these.
-Oh, you make them?
-Yeah, I make them.
I like drawing. I drew a lot.
-[Peter] Do you have any drawings here?
-No, I sent them all out.
I always send everything out.
[Eric] Oh, there is food.
Holy cow.
[Peter] What’s going on here?
I didn’t roll the camera ’cause
they might tell me to put it away
but a security guard
and they’re metering all the people
with a rope system.
-That’s new, Eric, I haven’t seen that.
-I’ve never seen that in a long time.
[Michael] That’s probably due to
large amounts of theft I would guess.
Yeah, so these are just whatever…
Just a simple shirt,
and really simple pants.
I found Boyz n the Hood.
[laughter]
-Or just a black shirt.
-A black shirt.
-I thought that was nice.
-Is that the right size?
-Yeah, XL.
-Okay.
It feels weird just watching
civilians everywhere, you know?
Of course I’m a civilian now,
but being around people that I haven’t
been around in 12 years, it’s just crazy.
-Crazy all the amount of
colors and moving things?
Yes, people moving around.
Living a normal life don’t even know
what’s going behind walls.
You know what I mean?
What’s really happening down there.
I got anxiety building up, man.
-Oh, dude, whatever you want me to do,
if you want to chill in the car for a bit,
whatever, it’s your program, man.
Yeah, just get it over with
already and get out of here.
-Okay.
-I’ll hold the shoes, bro.
-[woman] And it’s just three.
-Mm-hmm.
Three.
-Okay, let me open that for you.
-Dude, I absolutely hate shopping.
-I hate stopping too.
[Peter] You’re going back in, man.
Yeah, going back in prison.
You know what I mean?
I’ll see you later.
[laughter]
That is crazy. I just got out.
[Eric] Hey, Mike, Peter.
[Peter] How’s it look, man?
[Eric] I don’t know. I feel weird.
[laughter]
[Peter] You’re jacked.
-Oh, yeah.
-[Peter] Yeah, that looks good.
That’s way better.
[Peter] We’re almost there.
So the guy was just saying
who works here,
the laws have loosened a lot.
People can just walk in and walk out
with a thousand dollars of whatever.
-And they can’t stop them?
-Yeah.
Why?
Things have changed, man.
So isn’t it a store?
Don’t they have security?
They’re concerned because if you
tackle the guy who’s stealing
then he’s going to sue the store
for a million dollars.
So let him have the thousand
dollars in the store.
That’s my opinion, I’m not sure
if that’s the corporate policy
but I think a lot of people sue.
They come in, they steal, and they sue.
Yeah, you wanna to tackle me,
you know? I want to make a quick buck.
[Peter] How you doing, ma’am?
I got this one.
Do you want to change
in the fitting rooms
-Can I change in the fitting room?
-Yeah, I can let them know.
-I gotcha.
-I appreciate it.
I’ll mic you up real quick.
Bam.
-[Peter] Bam, looking good, man.
-Thank you.
-Nice shoes.
-Thank you.
[Peter] Thank you. Take care. Bye-bye.
[Eric] I’m in regular clothes now.
Now you can call me civilian.
Now you can call me civilian.
I appreciate that, guys.
Thank you very much.
-Oh, you’re welcome.
-It’s whatever you want, bro.
-Well, let’s kill two birds and one stone.
Let’s go to 4th Ave,
let’s go get pizza right there.
It’s Brooklyn-style pizza.
-We might want to make sure
that it’s still there.
A lot of restaurants
went under during COVID.
Oh, yeah?
It was a little tiny restaurant.
I mean, nothing but, like, it was…
-Still there.
-Still there? All right, off we go.
Yeah. Let’s go.
So you were saying just last night,
some guys were saying they can
get you work out here
but not the type of work you want.
They basically wanted me to
work for them out here, for them inside.
-That’s pretty common.
-And I said no.
Especially ’cause I was in the mix,
and I know a lot of people
and I won their trust, you know,
so it’s hard to come up by people
that are trusted in prison, you know?
You have to be, like…
You have to prove yourself 100%.
And I told them no, like, that’s it.
I did 12 years,
I did my time, I served it.
That’s it. No more.
Like, it’s time to move forward
and lead people in the right direction.
I’m back in the direction
to lead people into prison.
And there’s a lot of people
that are scared
to reach out for help or, like,
they think that the world,
just because they’re a felon,
all doors close for them
and they say yeah,
well, to make a quick buck.
-It’s the easy route, right?
-It’s the easy route ’cause…
-It’s comfortable.
It’s comfortable and that’s what
they’re used to, you know what I mean?
So they’re scared to look for resources,
to reach out for help.
So they go back to that life
and they don’t know that it’s just
you’re gonna fall right back into prison.
-So work, you’re open to anything,
any type of job?
I’m open to anything, honestly.
I’m not gonna pick and choose,
you know, work’s work, money’s money.
I’d rather… I’ll clean a yard
and make $10 a day
than go back to
doing what I was doing.
I mean at least I know
I’m making the right choice this time.
Oh my God, you weren’t lying.
They really have chargers on the wall.
-Yeah, you can just plug in your car.
-What the…
[Michael chuckles]
-[Peter] This is downtown Tucson?
-[Michael] This is downtown Tucson.
-It’s pretty quiet.
-In all its glory.
-At night time it’s a different story.
-Yeah.
I never hit none of these bars.
I used to just come and just walk.
-I locked up when I was 18, you know?
-Right.
-You couldn’t drink.
I couldn’t drink so I would just
walk around right here
just look at people drinking outside
be like, “I want a drink.”
you know what I mean?
When’s the last time you’ve had a drink?
I was never really a drinker.
I didn’t like alcohol
’cause I couldn’t control it.
I like to be in my conscience at all
times ’cause anything can happen.
I’ve seen it. I’ve seen a lot of
stuff happen before, you know?
When I was younger
so I would avoid it all.
[Peter] Go ahead, ma’am.
Thank you.
[Michael] Thank you.
Eric, you take the honors.
Oh yeah, first bite.
It’s usually ladies first but after
12 years we gotta go Eric’s first.
-We’ll make an exception.
-We’re breaking the rule for today.
-[Eric] Well, do we give grace first?
-[Michael] Yeah, absolutely.
Our father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.
Your kingdom come,
your will be done on Earth as in Heaven.
Give us this day, our daily bread,
and forgive us for our debts
To not lead us to temptation
but deliver us from the evil one.
Your power and glory forever
in Jesus’ name, amen.
-Amen.
-Amen.
[Eric] Thank you. Thank you.
-Tastes the same like 12 years ago.
-[Michael chuckles]
Pretty good?
I haven’t had a pizza
in what is it, like, 7 years?
-Fundraiser?
-Yeah, fundraiser, Little Caesars.
-Yeah, yeah.
-Little Caesars.
That doesn’t compare,
Little Caesars sucks.
I used to buy Little Caesars too
at the fundraisers but this is real pizza.
-This is good pizza.
-It’s hot.
I appreciate you guys taking the time
to spend the day with me.
It does mean a lot
and I do appreciate it.
-Thanks for hanging out.
-Thank you.
No problem.
-You could have said no very easily.
-Yeah.
What do you want to do after this?
Whatever you want to do.
Did you commit your crimes in Tucson?
Do you want to go there
and talk about what happened?
-Yeah, I’ll show you.
This is good. Nice greasy pizza.
Yeah.
I spent all my 20s in prison.
So I feel like I missed out on a lot.
[Peter] Okay, you’re 31.
What were birthdays like in prison?
Is that a thing at all or no?
I didn’t celebrate birthdays,
Christmases, nothing.
-You don’t celebrate anything?
Your friends around you? No one knows?
Well, I was real… I was real to myself.
I was real isolated.
Imagine, I was always in a cell.
That was the first three yard I hit
in 11 years and two months.
First three-yard I hit.
-So you were on fours and fives?
-The whole time.
-Fours and fives meaning
the maximum security?
-The maximum security, yeah.
-Always.
Like, I had barely came down
out of SMU, too like nine months ago.
I had barely came out of SMU too.
-That’s the supermax.
-Mm-hmm.
Oh, what were you guys saying
in the car about in prison
you could share cigarettes
or how does that work?
So we can smoke a cigarette together.
-No, we can’t.
-We cannot smoke a cigarette together,
drink a soda together,
eat food together.
-Because you’re different colors.
-Yeah, different races.
But we can slam heroin together
if you want.
It’s a weird rule that makes no sense.
You can do drugs together,
but you can’t share no food, nothing.
-[Brianda] And that’s an inmate rule?
-Yeah.
If we get caught smoking
a cigarette together
we’re gonna get beat up.
So why do the higher-ups
put that rule in place?
I never understood that one.
So a bond can’t be built.
Always have rules against each other
and always know boundaries.
So basically we don’t grow
a relationship and get closer.
So we know there’s a space
and there’s a line between us.
-Oh.
-That’s why.
Like, food is something
to connect people, even a cigarette?
We’re connected right now.
Different races.
We’re connected. Eating as a one.
-But heroin doesn’t connect people?
-No, ’cause we’re killing each other.
So they’d rather you kill each other
than sit down and share a meal together.
-You didn’t know that?
-I didn’t know that.
That’s interesting.
And the paraphernalia you need to get
to do that is extremely difficult to get.
It has to be stolen from medical
and there’s limited amounts that you can…
So I haven’t shared a meal with
a different race in a long time.
-How does that feel?
Weird, but it feels good.
Actually it does feel good.
I mean with different people.
Like, I never ate with a woman
in a long time.
You know what I mean,
a cop-looking guy.
[laughter]
-A White Black guy?
-A White Black guy.
That looks straight Mexican.
You know what I mean?
[Eric] Look at that Mustang right there.
-That’s a nice Mustang right there.
-[Peter] That’s beautiful.
[laughs] Look at this. Look at this.
“I know you’re cheating, Lily.
I have all the videos.”
-What is it?
[man] Is there any chance
you have a dollar to cut my hair.
[Peter] No, dude. Just do this.
Bro, you just need a razor. Shave it.
I got the first half on a loan.
-If you go to a barber
he’ll do it for free.
Every time I want to go bald,
I guarantee you’ll go for free.
[Eric] I got a razor in the car.
I’ll shave it for you right now.
It feels so good.
-This part of town has gone crazy.
-Yeah it is, man.
[Peter] What do you think of that?
The capable guy asking you for money.
It’s weird. It’s sometimes just…
We know what it’s for.
If he’s hungry or thirsty he’ll be like,
“Hey, can you get me something
to eat?” I’ll get him something to eat.
-I got a question, Mike.
-Yeah?
When you got out
did you feel all eyes on you?
Yeah, the first couple weeks I didn’t
really go out too much because of that.
I only went to work and then I went home.
I feel like they’re just
looking at me like…
It’s like, you’re a little paranoid
and it’s normal.
Like, I was too.
You’re going to think that people
are looking at you or people can tell.
For the longest time
I only wore long sleeves.
And she’d tell me,
“Babe, nobody cares about your tattoos.”
but I would try to hide them.
For like nine months
I tried to hide my tattoos.
Yeah, like, I feel like…
It’s probably easy.
I mean, like, I feel… I do feel.
I wouldn’t allow people in the yard
to walk behind me.
-I was just going to say that.
-I wouldn’t allow them.
You’re not gonna get used to that.
-[Peter] In prison that’s a threat?
-Exactly, behind you.
[Michael] It doesn’t feel natural
because in prison people don’t do it.
They’ll stay a distance.
They’ll stay a hand distance
far from you.
-You give everyone a lot of space?
-Yeah, like a distance.
-Yeah, stay out of my bubble.
-Yeah, exactly. You know how I’m feeling.
-[Peter] Just a drug deal right behind us?
-[Michael] Yeah.
You saw that?
-Right away, you learn it from prison.
Don’t film it.
From a mile away
we can tell what they’re doing.
Body language. Panic.
She looks too scared.
-Eyes wide open.
-Yeah, like, come on, bro.
You gon’ do it, do it right.
Okay, so you saw those kids your age,
when you went in, in broad daylight.
Yeah.
[Michael] It’s so common.
Me and Raquel see them all the time now.
These kids, it’s sad.
It’s sad to see them
but it’s just they’re going to learn.
That’s why I hope… I hope a video
could help, you know what I mean?
Impact a life.
Like, a kid could see, like,
That ain’t the life they want.
You know what I mean?
When they have to give away so much time.
[Eric] When my girl went to go
visit me, my homeboy Bobby,
he’s all like,
“I slit his throat and he deserved it.”
That’s the first time Brianda went
to go visit me and she heard that.
[Peter] Okay, who slit whose throat?
What he’s doing all day.
I mean, he don’t care.
My homeboy Bobby was like,
“Hey, Eric.” I’m like, “What’s up?”
He’s like, “Do you remember Silent?”
“Yeah, what’s up? Where’s he at?”
He was doing all day too.
He has 299 years to do.
-When you say all day, you mean for life?
-Life.
He has 299 years.
And I’m like, “Yeah, what about him?”
and he’s like, “Well, I slit his throat.”
“Why?” And he’s all like,
“Eh, ’cause I felt like it.”
He’s like, “Yeah, I told him
to look under the door
and I slit his throat.”
I’m like, “Wow.”
And remember, Brianda, she just
looked at me and her eyes got watery.
And I’m all like, “Babe, it’s all right,
relax, take a deep breath.”
She started getting
anxiety just hearing that.
She’s all, “Babe,” she’s all
like, “Don’t be in that.”
I’m like, “I’m not no more.”
-Yeah. She’s girlfriend not wife, right?
-Yeah.
[Peter] So did she…
and shut me up when you want.
I totally get it. It’s private stuff
but did she date other people
while you were in prison?
-No, of course she did.
She was honest with me.
Yeah, I respected that.
We’re open, I mean were friends.
-And you were cool with it?
Yeah, I was okay with it
because I put myself in prison.
She told me not to do the crimes
and I still did.
I’m the one that went to prison.
It wasn’t her fault.
I couldn’t tell her,
“Hey, you’re going to be with me.
You’re going to pause your life.”
I couldn’t be selfish.
That would have been me being selfish.
What I was doing, I knew the life
I was heading, I knew the consequences.
Don’t get me wrong.
Yeah, I would get mad
when she’d tell me
and it would hurt me,
and I would sit there, and I would cry
in the cell with pain.
Because I was a broken heart
but I chose this life.
She didn’t choose it.
She would tell me, “Babe, work, work.”
And I’d be like,
“Nah, let’s go make this easy money.”
She would sometimes sit there and cry,
and beg me not to go,
and I’d be like, “Nope.”
-So that’s common,
you were saying that, Michael, right?
-That’s what most guys do
with a long sentence.
Sometimes you’ll see the old dudes
who’ve been married for 20 years,
their wives will just wait it out.
But most of the young guys like us
when we’re starting a long sentence,
we tell them to pretty much move on.
Just go. Just move on.
Because I don’t want to be in my cell
worried about where you are.
That’s the worst feeling in the world.
-Drive a person crazy.
“Oh my God, where’s she at?”
You’re already in prison and now
you’re worried about something like that.
-You’re in prison within a prison.
-Yeah.
And you’re driving yourself crazy.
-So you just tell them go.
Just go do whatever you’re going to do.
-And if it’s meant to be, they’ll…
-Exactly.
-It’s meant to be and she’s right there.
-Exactly.
I told her when she came back,
“I don’t care about your past.
I don’t care about nothing.
It’s a fresh start, a new slate.
Let’s begin again.”
‘Cause how is a relationship
going to be built with hatred?
Remembering the past,
you know what I mean?
That’s not love.
That’s just a hate relationship.
[Michael] It was important
to keep that structure in your life.
You want a schedule, you want a job.
I had a buddy who got out
six months before me.
And as soon as I got out he called me
and he was like,
“Hey, I’m already working,
I got this job for you.”
I got out Thursday and I walked
into that place on a Friday
and they hired me on the spot.
And they said start Monday.
So I went to work immediately.
[Peter] Do you have anyone you can
reach out to about employment
or is there any help on that front?
I don’t know nobody here.
Okay, is there any like State of Arizona,
or Tucson City, or something?
They told me about First Job.
One Job Stop, something like that?
One Job Stop?
[Michael] I’ve got a couple friends
in Tucson.
One Job Stop, I’ll try to look it up.
[Peter] Eric, this is where
the crime happened?
This is where the crimes happened.
Go more down.
It was right here to my right.
[Eric] So, 12 years ago,
exactly right here,
I broke into this house right here,
I kicked the door in.
I went in with a… a shotgun.
Me and my jack crew people,
we tied the people up.
And we started… we robbed them.
We robbed them for 200 pounds.
-[Peter] 200 pounds of what?
-Marijuana.
It was the time of marijuana.
When we had them tied up and everything
I think the neighbors had seen
and they called the cops.
The cops surrounded the place.
And that’s what got me my time.
For holding people hostage,
you know what I mean?
A lot of crimes had popped up
and everything
that had,
like, familiar cases.
You know, and I’m back to the place
where it all started 12 years ago.
Back to the same place
where it all started 12 years ago.
-You know?
-Wild.
Yeah, it’s wild.
But in a different position.
Where everything good
is in front of you
if you want it to be.
Correct, you know?
Now, I’ll tell the people
that are watching this,
you’re young, you’re a teenager,
this ain’t the life you want.
It might seem exciting,
it might seem fun, but it ain’t fun.
All you’re gonna do
is hurt the people you love.
You know what I mean?
You’re gonna throw away so much,
you know what I mean?
You’re gonna throw away so much.
You know what I mean?
Live a right life.
Get a good job, finish school.
Listen to your parents.
You know what I mean?
Follow the law.
‘Cause if you don’t follow the law,
it could be taken away from you.
Cherish life, value life.
‘Cause it could be taken away from you
in the blink of an eye.
Look at me, I’m starting after 12 years,
I have nothing.
Just a pair of clothes I just have
to my name.
That was bought from… thanks to you,
Peter, and Michael, and Raquel.
You know what I mean?
I went in with 9.25 years
and I caught another year and a half
trying to reach the stars
in the politic life.
Like I said, I respect them all the way,
I tried reaching that and I lost a lot.
But what I’mma do now
is I’d rather make $10 a day
than spend another day in prison.
[Peter] Brianda, you’re so patient.
Just another day, huh, Eric?
[Eric] Just another day, you know?
-Breakfast started in one place,
dinner ends in another.
-Yeah, that’s crazy.
[Michael] Uh-oh, I see balloons.
[Peter] Oh!
[Eric] This is crazy.
Oh my God, this is my home, right?
Home sweet home, come here.
[Michael] It looks awesome.
[Peter] Do you have some chores
for Eric already?
Yeah, I have a clothes rack
for him to build.
I have some shelves.
I have the curtain rods.
Oh, look at the drawing, look.
-You drew that?
-Yeah.
Oh, nice.
[Raquel] Are you a Star Wars fan?
-Yeah.
-Me too.
This is a Darth Vader rug
but it’s, like, incognito.
-Oh, it is a Darth Vader rug.
Oh, that’s so cool.
Raquel’s a hardcore Star Wars fan.
Brianda, what do you think
of my shopping consultancy?
-I helped Eric with this outfit.
-Looks good!
-I got him what I would have worn.
-He picked it out.
-It looks really good.
I didn’t ask you this today, but are
your mother or father around, or no?
My mom’s in Texas
and my dad’s in Mexicali.
-Okay.
Other than that,
I do have a stepsister here,
but I don’t talk to her that much.
-Mom happy to see you?
Yeah, I love my mom.
She’s been calling me nonstop
since he got out.
She’s basically the only one
I have here in Tucson,
you know what I mean?
And I chose to stay here ’cause of her
or ’cause of the sickness,
you know what I mean? Everything.
So, basically…
Wow, you guys… Is there anything else
I should have asked today?
No, is there anything else
you guys want to say?
I just want to say thank you.
I enjoyed my day with you guys
and thank you for taking the time
and not judging me for my past,
you know what I mean?
‘Cause it is my past now.
Those gates closed.
You didn’t ask for my advice,
but day-by-day,
take it day-by-day,
get that regularity,
that consistency
that you’re talking about,
and, like, the world’s your oyster.
You’re young, you’re lucky,
you’re young in that respect.
Like, everything’s ahead,
and you got a great woman
that’s here for you, so…
[Eric] I appreciate it, man.
-All the best.
-Thank you.
-I’m rooting for you… big time.
-Appreciate it.
-Thank you for documenting this.
-No, thanks for doing it.
You didn’t have to, and I think a lot of
people wouldn’t open up like you did.
-And so a lot of respect, admiration.
-I appreciate that.
-It was nice meeting you.
-Bye-bye.
I wish you all the best.
-Talk to you soon. I’m gonna reach out
to some people down here too.
-Thanks for being so cool.
-Hey, stay free.
Did you like to talk about
the church that we were talking about?
-You got this, all right?
-I appreciate that, man.
So I was talking to them about a church
and it turns out that he knows the pastor.
-Yeah, I’m pretty sure
it’s my buddy Chris Tarzan.
I’m about 99% positive.
He’s a big Mexican guy and he has
the lowrider symbol on his head.
You know like the little lowrider guy?
He’s got that on the back of his head.
It’s huge, yeah.
But he’s a pastor there,
and his story is awesome.
Yeah, because I’m seeking a church
and everything.
Like I said, I’m not just
’cause I got out of prison.
I’m not just because I was in prison
now I’m going to move forward with it.
I can move forward further
and become further into the church.
That’s what I want.
Yeah, it’ll keep you grounded.
That structure
like Bible study on Wednesdays
and service on Sundays, and work,
and you won’t have energy
for anything else.
[laughter]
I appreciate that.
It was so nice to meet you
and thank you so much.
-Thank you for everything.
-Thank you.
[Eric] Thank you. Thanks, Mike.
-Thank you.
-Talk to you guys soon.
All right.
Keep us updated.
You can get the number through Mike.
-Yeah, I’ll reach out.
-I don’t know the phone number.
-You’ll have to program the phone first.
But Brianda has my number,
if you guys need help just give us a call.
All right, thank you.
-Bye. Thank you.
-All right.
[Peter] I’m going to leave today
thinking about this for days.
Thanks for bringing us all in.
-Thank you.
-It’s very unique content.
Like I wouldn’t be able
to access that on my own.
I love what you guys do
and for all of you out there,
you got to check out their channel.
Show me the shirt.
Oh, yeah.
Time served.
Link down below in the description.
If you want to see more
of these types of stories,
everyone is different, right?
Yeah, every video is different.
We pick up men, women, young, old.
Okay, it’s a great idea.
I love your dynamic
because you worked in there
on the correction side,
you were in there as a prisoner.
You’re a couple. That’s cool in itself.
-A great couple.
-Yeah, great couple.
And now you understand that world
better than any of us
that have never been in prison.
So I think you’re
the right people for the job.
-Cool… Yeah.
-Thank you.
-No, thanks a lot. You were awesome.
-Appreciate it, man.
Thanks, guys, for coming along
on that journey.
Until the next one.